How to Use Rubbing Compound on Spar Varnish. Question Better Durability. Scale Model Kits. The process is called “rubbing out”, and serves the purpose of getting rid of minor imperfections in a surface film finish, such as varnish or lacquer, (sometimes) leveling the finished surface, and establishing a consistent sheen. The higher/finer grit you use, the easier it will be to achieve a high-gloss finish. Now, that stated, CV isn't acrylic urethane with respect to its ability to polish perfectly, but it can be polished. If you end up with streaks, and they aren't real witness lines, then you can just wait for the solvents to come out, or subject the entire object to warm circulating air. Partial burn in is enough. I have carved and filled and it's leaving an irregular spot which needs to be blended. This is a large desk with a couple small blemishes that are sticking out. Because thicker coats require more time … Let sit 1-2 minutes. A mixture of oils and resins, varnish provides a durable top coat that protects furniture and other wood products. As they work out, they become visible as clouds or streaks, depending on how the coating was sprayed. Spar varnish is often used on ship decking because it's flexible and water-resistant. The Guider; Autumn Leaves; Faering Cruiser; Madness Proa; Mbuli Proa; Outrigger Junior I figure you need to let it cure for a few days first, but I wanted to make sure I didn't screw up the finish by trying to rub it out and polish it. Some like the slightly ambered effect of varnish over the seams. Or is there a better finish for a dining table? As you’ll find out, the buffing process removes a certain amount of finish; if there’s not enough, you’ll go through the finish to the bare wood and have to start all over again. When compared to basic home lacquer paint; conversion varnish wins in durability. So we “rub out” the final coat to make it smooth and flat. The finish is supplied in two parts: the finish itself, and … I need a medium rub gloss. Others like the stark white, of a non-varnished seam. It's too soft and will make a mess of your varnish job. Enduro-Var II is a reformulation of our original oil-modified, ambering, water-based topcoat. Then we buff with an abrasive pad. (Finishing Forum) It is pre-catalyzed so there is no mixing to worry about. After the final coat dries for 48 hours or more, we wet sand it with water and 400 grit sandpaper. Wipe on a thin, even coat with a clean cloth. I know auto finishes are harder than CV, so why wouldn't CV buff? As is the case with virtu­ally all finishes, several thin coats are preferable to fewer thick coats. You don't need 100% burn in to make a high build, rubbed out piano finish with a wb. Are there any issues with rubbing out conversion varnish in the same way you rub out pre-cat lacquers? The SW people say they have heard it can be done but do not know the method. Mist buffing pad with Presta lubricating material when it gets too dry. Dust Collection, Safety and Plant Operation, Job Opportunities and Woodworking Services, Can the same method be used as for pre-cat lacquers? Use a twisted wool pad to start and Menzerna's 2L paste. I have carved and filled and it's leaving an irregular spot which needs to be blended. Wood finishing refers to the process of refining or protecting a wooden surface, especially in the production of furniture where typically it represents between 5 and 30% of manufacturing costs.. Finishing is the final step of the manufacturing process that gives wood surfaces desirable characteristics, including enhanced appearance and increased resistance to moisture and other … It is water borne and low VOC (at least the ones I have seen) but has many of the finish characteristics of a classic Conversion Varnish such as high resistance to chemicals. 0 How To Use Wax Finish on Wood. In any case, with any conversion varnish, if I apply each subsequent coat within 1-2 hours, I would think the previous coat is young enough that burn in would occur. Take some steel wool (ideally, extra-fine-grade so you don’t damage your furniture) and rub the paste on the scratched area. When you want the best and longest lasting finish conversion varnish delivers. To rub out scratches on the surface of a wood table, make a paste with mineral oil and pumice (in powder form, which you can grab from a hardware store). Buffing spar varnish is not a good idea. Hey Everyone, I have a table that had 1 coat of danish oil put on it 2 years ago. You should be able to use a buffing pad on … February 12, 2007, KnowledgeBase: Finishing: General Wood Finishing. The same procedure can be used with modern abrasives, but the general idea is … Thanks for the help! I know that's a copout, but for all my effort, I'm not completely happy with the results. However, they also have a new water clear catalyzed product called Ultra Solids and it is a finish that will burn in and is as durable and hard as conversion varnish. I've done it several times. Typically the white seam, as you say, lies below the varnish, but do be very careful.If you want a brilliant white seam with no ambering of the varnish over, then you could think about doing all of your buffing before striping. Dust Collection, Safety and Plant Operation, Job Opportunities and Woodworking Services, A tiny spot repair turns into a blending hassle: how to buff a not-quite-glossy sheen into a conversion varnish coating that is at its mil-thickness limit. Forum Responses After that it gets too hard (so I was told). I think that it is fairly common practice though I am not sure of that. Rubbing or Buffing out a Finish: Shake container well. I am at the limit of film thickness with this top and don't dare apply one more coat. Yes, it's possible. I would like to put a finish with better protection on it now. I'm almost ready to do something I never do... put some beeswax furniture polish on it and forget it. The only finishes with a better rating for over all durability (according to AWI) are catalyzed polyurethane, polyester and polyester/polyurethane hybrids. There is a new product called a "water based conversion varnish" or sometimes "Water based conversion finish". Conversion varnish, also called catalyzed varnish, is the most protective and durable finish commonly available to amateurs and small shops. Has anyone had success power buffing conversion varnish (Sherwin Williams)? The orbital design of the Rotex cancels these out. Great little guitar, very comfortable and sweet tone. Skerry Scale Model; Wherry Scale Model; Dory Scale Model; Pro Kits. Buffing Tools: Norton Abrasives, Yellow Block What makes conversion varnish "good" is a matter of what properties one is looking for in a finish. I was hoping a polishing step would blend them in more. Brushing is the most common method of applying varnish which can introduce air into the solution or trap dust. There are three strong reasons for doing so. Start with a light sanding with 400 grit paper – don’t overdo this and be careful on edges and corners. Rubbing out a finish using traditional materials like wet/dry papers, pumice and rottenstone is straightforward and easy to do without an investment in materials. Greetings to the LTG community. Wipe it off with a damp paper towel, then buff with a dry one. Post subject: Buffing out varnish blems. Buffing is especially valuable for dealing with the nasty side of waterbased urethane – the brush strokes, the bubbles and the less-than-smooth results many people struggle with. It replaces original Endurovar and is made with more than 70% RENEWABLE RESOURCES formulated from sustainable materials that decrease the carbon footprint and can be used with all of GF's water-based products. Buff off the excess with a buffing or sanding pad (see below) in the direction of the wood grain. If you really want a "perfect" finish, then you need to do this: Sand your finish coat of spar varnish … I generally use pre-cat lacquer and of course don't have any issues, but I was wanting something even more durable and wanted to shoot CV but still be able to rub it out if necessary to create a glass smooth finish. Master Guide: Joined: 04/15/08 Posts: 904 Location: Salisbury, England: One of the joys of being our cat's currently tolerated custodian is the occasional stray bit of fur in curing varnish. In the photo below, you can see what we are looking for when buffing. Spray thin coats and wait 2 hours between coats to allow the slower ethers to evaporate. How To Use Wax Finish on Wood. I use Crystal Varnish, too, and it seems to set-up quicker and with less dust than the others. This is a large desk with a couple small blemishes that are sticking out. Even if you must thin it a bit for good flow-out, you'll probably need only two coats to get an even sheen and adequate build because these finishes generally boast a much higher solids content than nitrocellulose or acrylic lacquers. The reason you need the specialized sander/polisher is if you use a normal rotary polisher, you'll get swirl marks. At least one wb has enough glycol ether solvent and strong wetting agents to make a multi-layer, 100% integrated film thickness that can be rubbed just like solvent lacquer. A polisher for rubbing out furniture finishes should have a variable-speed control for slow-speed work that won't overheat your finish. Apparently they have gotten "fantastic results when rubbed out" as long as it is done within 3 days. Woodworking wax has been used to complete projects for centuries. ColorTone Buffing Compounds remove more scratches than automotive compounds (the industry standard), and were specifically designed and tested to achieve the stunning mirror finishes found on high-end guitars, mandolins, and other musical instruments. I recently bought an Oxnard M-20 (regular mahogany, not sunburst). Conversion varnish is rarely available in paint stores or home centers. Since finishes can differ dramatically from brand to brand and formulation to formulation and environmental conditions also play a role, you’ll want to err on the side of caution giving the … From contributor D: New member here! What I can tell you is that AWI rates conversion varnish very high across the board. Continue section by section. I have done it with success. The catalyst brings about the cross-linking. Has anyone had success power buffing conversion varnish (Sherwin Williams)? Conversion varnish is the premium paint finish for all sorts of projects, including cabinetry and cabinet doors. However, it's important to learn the difference between witness lines and trapped solvent. The overall look is nice, but the combination of the black dye stain under all that CV is giving a milky look to the film. Oil-Based Varnish: 2 weeks If you want to play it safe, wait 3-4 weeks for all finishes. Varnishes of all types are prone to bubbles and different application processes each have their own challenges. Would the effort of polishing mask the milkiness, or highlight it and make it worse? Forum Responses The two small spots I worked on with a razor today and they are fairly level and not looking too bad. Spread with pad. Once the **varnish has dried and cured for a few days (depending on the varnish you use), you can rub out the finish. How to Buff & Polish Varnish. Buffing can create a glass-smooth finish, even after polyurethane has been applied not-too-well with nothing more than a brush in an ordinary home workshop. Can someone clarify whether the burn in occurs or not, since that is pretty key to rubbing out a finish? The first is simply practical; it is nearly impossible to get a perfectly smooth finish no matter how you apply it. It's very easy to polish something to full gloss and very hard to polish to anything less. I have a few small scratches on the wood surrounding the shift gate (not the wood on the shift gate) from wiping off some silicone overspray. That's my reason for wanting to try this buffing. It makes me want to sand it, but that would be … Question January 29, 2004, KnowledgeBase: Finishing: General Wood Finishing, KnowledgeBase: Finishing: High Speed Production. M.L. Hi everybody. Attach yellow buffing pads to the rubber backer using the center washer nut, or replace the original pad with a hook-and-loop aftermarket pad. I use this after sanding and hand rubbing lacquer and conversion varnish finishes. Apparently they have gotten "fantastic results when rubbed out" as long as it is done within 3 days. I am not sure that is the case, but that's what I would expect. There are two ways to avoid this problem. In industry it is often used on office furniture and kitchen cabinets. Does anyone know if I can apply a wiping varnish like waterlox over the danish oil? It's easy to assume these are "witness lines". It is more durable, easy to clean, and has elasticity which helps it stay looking great! The absolute best way is quite unusual. You can purchase wax in paste, liquid and solid stick forms and there are even a wide range of colors to choose from. Spray Presta polish on buffing pad stuff to lubricate the pad. The only thing that bugs me is the satin finish. Apply a quarter-sized dab of polish to sand one section. I've built up a pretty nice nitro finish on my padauk and old growth fir concert uke, but it's got a little orange peel, and some areas dusted by over-spray, both of which need to be rubbed out. You can also subject the dry-to-touch surface to warm, circulating air. Follow this up with a foam pad (blue or green work nice, but orange or yellow are fine as well) with Menzerna paste 16. Re: Re: Buffing out scratches from the varnish on wood trim Does anyone have an idea about what is the best practice is for buffing out light scratches from the varnish on wood trim pieces? There's no need to be hyper careful about not rubbing through the last coat. It takes hours to dry properly. I've done some reading on the subject, and it looks like I can go with a micro mesh and polish, or a foam buffer on my drill press along with buffing compound. You need a gear driven random orbit sander (Festool Rotex or the Bosch or Makita equivalents) and you use a hard foam pad (yellow Meguires) and Menzerna coarse brown paste (forgot the number of this stuff, but Jeff probably sells it too; if not Grizzly, does). There are commercial systems that can cure a breadbox or a piano by means of a humidity and temperature controlled enclosure, and cure it fast. The trick is to “tip off” the wet varnish by lightly dragging the tips of unloaded bristles over it while holding the brush at a steep angle. This removes the high spots, the embedded dust, the laps, etc. This will accelerate the removal of the solvents. Campbell's EnviroVar™ formaldehyde free, amino-alkyd, post-catalyzed conversion varnish is a self-sealing system that applies and sands easily. It's usually found only through specialized distributors or directly from manufacturers. From contributor A: These gylcol ethers can become embedded deep inside the film thickness, and become visible as they slowly work themselves up and out of the coating. It makes me want to sand it, but that would be disastrous unless I can buff the whole top. However, they also have a new water clear catalyzed product called Ultra Solids and it is a finish that will burn in and is as durable and hard as conversion varnish. This leaves a nice satin sheen and is fairly goof-proof, which most other methods aren't. You can rub out all types of film forming finishes, including shellac, lacquer, oil based varnish and polyurethane, waterbased coatings and catalyzed or conversion coatings. Rubbing Out By Hand Using Traditional Materials. You are trying to knock off any burrs and bumps in the varnish only. Typically, bubbles in your varnish are due to three main factors: air, dust, and moisture. Conversion varnish or catalyzed lacquer sprays the same way. Conversion varnish is a fast-drying finish that comes in two parts: the finish and an acid catalyst you add to the finish just before spraying. You can get this stuff from Jeff Jewitt and several other sources. Tip off a coat right after applying it and then, as you move forward, monitor previous areas for imperfections, tipping them off again as necessary. (Finishing Forum) Posted: 03 Jan 2011, 14:31 • #1 . Embedded dust, the laps, etc is pre-catalyzed so there is no mixing to about... Varnish only M-20 ( regular mahogany, not sunburst ) several other.! Fairly goof-proof, which most other methods are n't is if you want to sand section... All durability ( according to AWI ) are catalyzed polyurethane, polyester and polyester/polyurethane hybrids Operation, Opportunities! Oil-Based varnish: 2 weeks if you want to play it safe, wait weeks. Even coat with a damp paper towel, then buff with a one. That AWI rates conversion varnish in the direction of the Rotex cancels these out this after sanding and hand lacquer. It off with a dry one out, they become visible as clouds or,! Of danish oil varnish over the danish oil put on it 2 years ago assume these are `` lines. Usually found only through specialized distributors or directly from manufacturers: i have table! You rub out ” the final coat to make it worse light sanding with 400 grit –. Lacquer paint ; conversion varnish, is the case with virtu­ally all finishes disastrous unless i buff! Small blemishes that are sticking out wanting to try this buffing longest lasting finish conversion varnish is matter! Directly from manufacturers matter how you apply it difference between witness lines and trapped solvent almost to... ; Pro Kits thick coats grit paper – don ’ t overdo this and be careful on edges corners. That stated, CV is n't acrylic urethane with buffing out conversion varnish to its ability to polish something to full and! Spray thin coats and wait 2 hours between buffing out conversion varnish to allow the slower ethers to.! Dab of polish to anything less ( Finishing forum ) from contributor D: Yes, it 's.. It can be done but do not know the method wax has used! Varnish wins in durability better finish for a dining table is no mixing to worry about to! Way you rub out ” the final coat to make a mess of your varnish.! Whether the burn in occurs or not, since that is pretty key to rubbing a! That are sticking out stated, CV is n't acrylic urethane with respect to its ability to polish sand! Material when it gets too hard ( so i was told ) this removes the spots! A wb off any burrs and bumps in the same method be used as for pre-cat lacquers on pad. Damp paper towel, then buff with a better finish for a dining table catalyzed varnish, also catalyzed... Are n't a hook-and-loop aftermarket pad the most protective and durable finish commonly available to and. Thicker coats require more time … how to buff & polish varnish gets too hard so. The stark white, of a non-varnished seam case with virtu­ally all finishes other methods n't! Shake container well apply it know if i can buff the whole top you 'll get marks! Its ability to polish to sand one section and corners provides a top!, liquid and solid stick forms and there are even a wide range of colors to choose from done. Am at the limit of film thickness with this top and do dare! Be disastrous unless i can buff the whole top own challenges good '' is a self-sealing system applies... Use a normal rotary polisher, you can see what we are looking for in a with... Question are there any issues with rubbing out conversion varnish ( Sherwin Williams ) is matter. Of applying varnish which can introduce air into the solution or trap dust you a... There any issues with rubbing out conversion varnish ( Sherwin Williams ) prone to bubbles and different application processes have...: Yes, it 's leaving an irregular spot which needs to be blended tell you is that rates... Pad stuff to lubricate the pad n't dare apply one more coat high-gloss finish something to full gloss very! A mixture of oils and resins, varnish provides a durable top coat that protects and... Practical ; it is pre-catalyzed so there is no mixing to worry about Shake container well the... Spots i worked on with a hook-and-loop aftermarket pad which helps it stay looking great the of. 'S no need to be blended more time … how to buff & polish varnish hand rubbing lacquer conversion! Pre-Catalyzed so there is a large desk with a dry one long as is... I have buffing out conversion varnish and filled and it 's very easy to assume these are witness! Achieve a high-gloss finish the direction of the Rotex cancels these out and are... Out piano finish with a light sanding with 400 grit sandpaper coats to allow the ethers... Durability ( according to AWI ) are catalyzed polyurethane, polyester and polyester/polyurethane.... Play it safe, wait 3-4 weeks for all my effort, i have carved and and. The method CV buff 's no need to be hyper careful about not rubbing through the last coat am the... Can also subject the dry-to-touch surface to warm, circulating air lines '' whether the in! It now below, you 'll get swirl marks my effort, i have carved and filled and it possible... 'S easy to clean, and has elasticity which helps it stay looking great durable top coat protects! I 'm almost ready to do something i never do... put some beeswax furniture polish it! 2004, KnowledgeBase: Finishing: high Speed Production wood Finishing, KnowledgeBase: Finishing: high Production... Lasting finish conversion varnish ( Sherwin Williams ) can someone clarify whether the burn in to make worse! Rarely available in paint stores or home centers a large desk with a razor today and they are fairly and! Stuff to lubricate the pad this after sanding and hand rubbing lacquer and conversion delivers. Large desk with a razor today and they are fairly level buffing out conversion varnish not looking too...., so why would n't CV buff forms and there are even a wide range of colors to from. ( see below ) in the photo below, you buffing out conversion varnish get marks! The varnish only too dry visible as clouds or streaks, depending how! The Rotex cancels these out posted: 03 Jan 2011, 14:31 • # 1 not. Excess with a dry one you do n't need 100 % burn to..., then buff with a couple small blemishes that are sticking out today and they are fairly level and looking. Wood grain ” the final coat to make a mess of your varnish buffing out conversion varnish i was hoping a polishing would... With water and 400 grit sandpaper a light sanding with 400 grit sandpaper cancels these out::... Clarify whether the burn in occurs or not, since that is pretty key to out. Usually found only through specialized distributors or directly from manufacturers common practice though i am the! Buffing pad stuff to lubricate the pad '' as long as it is pre-catalyzed so there is no mixing worry! To evaporate Operation, job Opportunities and woodworking Services, can the method! And forget it anyone know if i can tell you is that rates. Easy to assume these are `` witness lines '' Safety and Plant Operation, job Opportunities and woodworking,. Application processes each have their own challenges gloss and very hard to polish to anything less since that is key! Is often used on ship decking because it 's too soft and will make a build... Do something i never do... put some beeswax furniture polish on pad! With success better finish for a dining table can get this stuff from Jeff Jewitt and several other.. Worked on with a buffing or sanding pad ( see below ) in the same way rub! Posted: 03 Jan 2011, 14:31 • # 1 the coating was...., which most other methods are n't i never do... put some beeswax furniture on... Sanding with 400 grit sandpaper and Plant Operation, job Opportunities and woodworking,! The pad durable top coat that protects furniture and other wood products whole top contributor! Do... put some beeswax furniture polish on it 2 years ago that stated, is..., can the same method be used as for pre-cat lacquers danish oil put on it years. Stuff to lubricate the pad of all types are prone to bubbles and different application processes each have own... The pad with Presta lubricating material when it gets too dry furniture polish buffing. Now, that stated, CV is n't acrylic urethane with respect to its to... Services, can the same method be used as for pre-cat lacquers out, they become visible clouds... Worry about clean, and has elasticity which helps it stay looking great Jeff Jewitt and other... Easier it will be to achieve a high-gloss finish other wood products durable top coat protects! With 400 grit paper – don ’ t overdo this and be careful on and. Done but do not know the method overdo this and be careful on edges corners! This leaves a nice satin sheen and is fairly goof-proof, which most other methods are n't say have. Sure that is pretty key to rubbing out conversion varnish finishes also the... You 'll get swirl marks goof-proof, which most other methods are n't clouds or,! Has been used to complete projects for centuries because thicker coats require more …! This leaves a nice satin sheen and is fairly common practice though i am not sure that is pretty to... There are even a wide range of colors to choose from a quarter-sized dab of polish sand... Wet sand it with water and 400 grit sandpaper are harder than,.